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Miners => Den => Topic started by: kyyote on September 20, 2022, 08:36:41 AM

Title: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: kyyote on September 20, 2022, 08:36:41 AM

"...Offensively, there wasn't a whole lot of positives to what we did. When we did run the football, we ran it well. So, in retrospect, in hindsight, obviously should have run the ball more in that ball game. I think we had a game plan going in that obviously wasn't the right game plan or one that was effective at all. But we wanted to be aggressive, and we wanted to attack. We wanted to throw the ball quite a bit. And that ended up backfiring for us early..." -Dimel

So, you, the head coach had an obviously bad game plan that even you recognize wasn't the right game plan.  That is you, the head coach being wrong on the most basic thing a head coach does.  You wanted to pass.  "... in retrospect, in hindsight, obviously should have run the ball more in that ball game...".  This is called making adjustments, I think, and it is what a head coach does.  You win the damned game not hold to an wrong game plan that is so obvious everyone else knows what to do but you don't do it.  It didn't take retrospect or hindsight.  It takes not being brain dead.  Dimel needs to hand the reins over to anyone in the stands with a UTEP shirt on.  Let them call plays.  "...We wanted to throw the ball quite a bit. And that ended up backfiring for us early...".  So, you could run the ball well, your words, and early on the passing was backfiring, also your words, so you adjusted, right?  No!  You just kept up with the backfiring offense.  Brilliant!  Seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year for this brilliance.  Any one of the high school head coaches in El Paso could have won that game.

The next thing Dimel doees is blame a bad call and throw his quarterback under the bus in the same sentence, "...There was a PI (pass interference) on the play and our guy got grabbed. His arm got pulled and grabbed and it was a pick six, but that's part of the game. Sometimes things get missed. That was unfortunate because it was a significant play in the game, but I think we took an undue chance there. We didn't really have to force the ball into that type of a situation."

Another admission of his stupidity or ineptitude, you pick, "And again, as I go back and look just retrospect, we probably should have played that game a whole different way offensively and tried to get the type of score that we had last year against them, a low scoring ball game that the team that executes the best wins. But what we did is we got too aggressive, and we gave them opportunities."  And right into another throwing of a player under the bus with this "...But if you take out the pick six and you take out the touchdown that we got where Tyrin (Smith) fumbled right at the end zone, just those two plays changed the whole landscape of the ball game."  Then another admission of his stupidity "...I didn't do a great job of managing that game and playing the type of style that gave us the best chance to win. So, live and learn from that, but not good management of a ball game there in retrospect."  So, our old head ball coach is learning the basics as he goes along.  Well, no hurry.  "And again, in retrospect, we probably should lean more on them to run the football and control the game that way and kept it more of a close fight, less turnover type of ball game in that type of setting." Learning to coach!?

""I don't think we did a good job of taking passes that were there for us and being more patient. That was part of it. I don't think we were patient enough with our pass game, and we took a lot of shots. Our shots are usually a little bit more calculated than what they were in that game. And it's us. It's not Gavin (Hardison) taking the shots by any means but talking about us as an offensive football team. We probably took too many shots, and we didn't hit many. We usually hit some and we absolutely hit none that game except for the touchdown Tyrin (Smith) had and the one where he got to the one-yard line and fumbled.  ... So really our whole game plan of our passing concepts were not anywhere close to what they needed to be, and that was what led to us not having success on offense. We just didn't have a good, calculated attack in the pass game."
 
Finally;
On if the run game will be emphasized more
"It should and could be for sure. It's just how we match up in the run game against Boise State will be the question. If that's how the game plays itself out, it will be attacking their strength, but obviously, again, we can't worry too much about what their strengths and weaknesses are right now. We need to work our strengths because I feel like they got a really good football team and they got a lot of good football players and we got really a lot of good football players. And we might not be playing to that level, but we have a lot of good football players so we don't have to take a backseat to anybody talent wise when we take the field. And so what we need to do is do what we do and do it the best we can do it, you know. That's the emphasis for us right now as an offensive football team. So, I'm very frustrated with the way we've been performing with our lack of production, but I know we've got the talent to do better. So that's the encouraging part."
 
He actually says what we all feel, that we have the talent equal to anyone's talent but it is the coaching.  I have to say that at least Dimel knows it is him.  He doesn't know how to fix it but he knows that he is the problem.  Kind of.

So, this is Dimel.  Has the talent to win but goes in with wrong game plan and refuses to adjust to what the opponent is giving to win because either he won't or can't adjust.  That isn't my evaluation of him.  It is Dimel's valuation of him.  You can't fix stupid!  He has been coaching forever and he says he is trying to learn.  But it isn't like learning is lifelong, that kind of learning.  No, at 60 he is trying to learn his abc's.  Basic stuff.  It isn't like he was outcoached by some slick coaching.  It is your basic we were stupid and even when we knew what we were doing was stupid we just kept doing it.  Outcoached without the other coach even having to try.

This is perfect for summing up UTEP football.  Stupid doing and stupid enough to stay the course even when you are smart enough to know that it is stupid.  Making it even worse.

Since 2000, we have played 264 games.  We have won 37% of them and lost 63%.  Now, let's look at this a little closer.  I believe, that mathematically and a normal bell curve would show a normal team, normally would win big sometimes and be horrible sometimes.  A normal team would win about half and lose about half of the games.  Literally, you only have to win half of your games to be bowl eligible.  So, really you should be going bowling about half of the time.  We are 13% under just normal over a twenty-year stretch.  That isn't bad luck.  It isn't lack of talent.  It isn't El Paso being too wild, too sleepy, too short, too fat, or any other too except too willing to allow it.  Any head coach should have a 50% chance of winning going into the game.  Not a game, but the game of football.  Talent levels aren't the reason for losing 13% more than you win.  And if it is, it is a reflection of the coaching and who they put on the team.
Saban wins with top talent, but Georgia and aTm and all the rest have just as much talent.  UNM had no more better talent than the Man in the Moon.  It wasn't talent that beat the Miners.  It was stupid coaching that lost for the Miners.  We do stupid coaching better than any other team in the country.  Even the damned Aggies almost always have better coaches.  You watch.  The aggies playing in cusa will quickly have a better record than us once they aren't having to play a power 5 team every week.  Talent level is like water and seeks its own level within the container, or in this case the conference, it is in.    We play a cupcake and a power 5 team each year.  Should be at 50% winning and losing there.  We supposedly play a couple of equal teams.  This year it was UNM and Boise.  The conferences are close enough that talent shouldn't be and even Dimel said it wasn't a problem.  Boise should maybe have a slight edge in talent, but so slight it isn't the type of factor that wins or loses.  Coaching can make enough of a difference along with good play to overcome any talent difference at this level.

We, UTEP, lose 63% of our games because of coaching!  It is that simple.  Coaches losing ten games a season as accepted normal is abnormally bad coaching and coaching hiring and management.  Hire bad coaches and give them lengthy extensions for not sucking horribly for one season.  The standard should be that you get three years and at the end of three years you had better have won more games than you lost.  Ain't rocket science.  After three years you are not to fall under .500 more than once.  You can have an under 50% year once per chances, but after that it is considered to be less than what we want.  Too much losing for a team that wants winning.  Mediocrity would be always in the middle.  We are way below mediocre.  Mediocre should be easy.  You just have to be normal.  We aren't normal.  And the powers at UTEP have accepted abnormally horribly bad for ever.  The thing is, it isn't because we are simple poor farmers or any of that bullshit.  Dimel is making as much as the rest in Cusa.  IT isn't because everyone else is paying their coaches twice as much and we are at a disadvantage.  We are only at a disadvantage because of decisions made by administration.  Kugler was a buddy hire, and a bad one.  It wasn't like we got a bargain because he had no hc experience.  It was Stull rolling the dice with the school I love's money.  For his buddy.  Dimel.  Roll of the dice. 

Since 2000
Nord   14/34 29% wins
Price   48/61 44% wins
Kugler 18/43 30% wins
Dimel  12/37 24% wins

   

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: SisyphusMiner on September 20, 2022, 09:01:37 AM

Un-freakin-believable.  Obviously even a very competent head coach can go in with the wrong game plan, but competent ones adjust as the game progresses.

Dimel was OC at K State for 8 years before coming to us.  You'd think an OC with that kind of experience would know how to adjust his game plan?  Did they just win the games they did because the athletes were that good?   

I don't know if he would be a competent OC if he wasn't HC, but his game management and game plans indicate that he can't handle both simultaneously

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: MinerInWisconsin on September 20, 2022, 10:04:36 AM

This all should have been learned in the UNT game at the least. He should have learned how to adjust game plans in his first season as a head coach way back in his Wyoming days. Actually he should have learned how to adjust a game plan when he was an OC at Kansas St..

If he can't get this team back on track and bowl eligible he should either retire or be moved to another job in the athletic department.

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: kyyote on September 20, 2022, 12:12:04 PM

At UTEP

Since 2000
Nord   14/34 29% wins
Price   48/61 44% wins
Kugler 18/43 30% wins
Dimel  12/37 24% wins
 

Overall HC wins %
Nord   14/34 29% wins
Price   176/190 48% wins
Kugler  18/43 30% wins
Dimel   43/75 36% wins

Remember that Price took on seven or eight losses to his record taking over for Kugler and without them, his record at UTEP would be closer to the 48% than the 44% it shows at UTEP.  With that it seems to me that you get what you get.  Nord was only a head coach once and the same for Kugler.  Price was a lifetime 48%winning hc and did just about that at UTEP.  The good news is that Dimel should win a few more to become a regular 3 or 4 win per season coach given some more time.

But this is about UTEP football.  Senter has had enough time to set a tone.  He may have inherited Dimel but the start of this year, and particularly the UNM game should be all that is needed to come out with a we are going to go a different way press conference.  Even without the money to buy him out, he should have the reins taken from him by Senter to say that stupidity is just unacceptable.  But he won't.  UTEP won't.  UTEP is and has been for at least forty or more years perfectly willing to accept sub-mediocrity when it comes to football.  Which allows and lends support to a stereotypical thinking that those Hispanics on the border don't care about football.

This kind of thinking at the top of UTEP leadership undercuts so much the hard work that UTEP should be so very proud of in proving that the Hispanics UTEP serves can hang with anyone in the world.  It is almost criminal.  Just imagine if the football team was an exciting winning program and what that story would be like about the community and people of El Paso and the enormous leaps it has taken given the chance UTEP gave them.  It is Hollywood waiting for it to happen.  It can be done.  There are many examples of how to do it and the formula to follow.  We aren't trying.  It isn't even on Dimel.  He admits he doesn't know what he is doing.  It is Senter's fault.  He is supposed to be the adult, or unemotional guy who says this isn't cutting it.  You know, I know it, so we have to fix it.  And then get it done, cleanly, intelligently, and efficiently.  No drama.   

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: Minermojo on September 20, 2022, 01:13:44 PM

Well, this is the way I see it, plain and simple, Dismal is a loser as a coach and should be fired. He has no common sense. He's like those that want to do the same thing over and over again and have different results. If I bang my head against the wall again maybe this time I won't get a concussion.

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: orange-oink on September 22, 2022, 07:16:42 AM

Dimel?s offense is averaging a whopping 14 points per game,  good enough for #124 in scoring offense.   The defense is decent by UTEP standards but the offense is awful and this teams achilles heel.  It?s obvious Dimel is clueless and has no idea how to right the ship.  I would hope Senter would force him to surrender control of the offense but im afraid he?s as clueless as Dimel.   

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: kyyote on September 22, 2022, 12:11:41 PM

Since the beginning of the 21st century, UTEP has an average of 4.45 wins a yar.  This is held high by the 9 years under Mike Price when he averaged 5.3 wins a year over his 9 years.  Nord averaged 3.5 wins a year for four years and Kugler averaged 3.6 over 5.  Dimel is averaging 2.75 wins a year.  That does include a crazy covid 3 and 5 year.  For the 13 years under Nord, Kugler, and Dimel we average 3.28 wins a year.  Just off the top of my head, Price got extended, as did Kugler and Dimel.  Price had started with a Nord team that had gone 6-30 for the previous 3 years and won 8 games a year for the first two years.  An extension was in order.  You  have to figure out why Kugler and Dimel had to be protected from being stolen from us.  One final note.  Price averaged his wins against much stronger teams than Kugler and Dimel had played.

This is going to blow your little minds my friends.  Price was here from 04 to 13.  This is from the list of Miners in the Pro's;

Name                                                               First Year Pro KRIS ADAMS                                                     11 DUSTIN BELL                                                     10 JAMES DAVIDSON                                              14 MIKE AGUAYO                                                   10 BRYCE BENEKOS                                                05 SIR JAMES DELGARDO                                        07 GODWIN AKINDURO                                           05 ANTWON BLAKE                                                  12 ROBERT CLAYTON                                               05 QUINTIN DEMPS                                                 08 ELOY ATKINSON                                                  13 JAYSON BOYD                                                     06 CORNELIUS BROWN                                            10 TYLER EBELL                                                      07 SHERMAN AUSTIN                                               05 DONALD BUCKRAM                                             11 MATT CAMILLI                                                     12 ONIEL COUSINS                                                  08 JONAS CRAFTS                                                    05 BRANDER CRAIGHEAD                                         14 MICHAEL EDWARDS                                            13 JOE BANYARD                                                     12 DA?MON CROMARTIE-SMITH                                 10 ROBBY FELIX                                                       09 JAHMAL FENNER                                                  06 JOSH FERGUSON                                                10 JAMAR HUNT                                                       09 IBOK IBOK                                                           07 CHRIS FRANCIES                                                 06 DESHAWN GRAYSON                                            13 ROD HUNTLEY                                                     11 JOHNNIE LEE HIGGINS, JR.                                   07 HOWARD JACKSON                                              05 THOMAS HOWARD                                                06 GEORGE KELLY                                                     10 DONAVON KEMP                                                   12 AARON KING                                                       10 JOSE MARTINEZ                                                   12 MATT MCKINNON                                                 05 HORACE MILLER                                                  14 JEFF MOTURI                                                       10 ALEX OBOMESE                                                   07 HUMBERTO PADILLA                                            09 JORDAN PALMER                                                  07 DANIEL ROBINSON                                             07 ROBERT RODRIGUEZ                                           05 JON SALCIDO                                                     09 LORNE SAM                                                        08 REAGAN SCHNEIDER                                           07 KENDRICK SINGLETON                                        09 MELVIN STEPHENSON II                                      10 DAVID SUTTON                                                   07 DREW THOMAS                                                   13 MARCUS THOMAS                                               08 BRYANT TISDALE                                                09 TREVOR VITTATOE                                               11 ADRIAN WARD                                                    05 CLARENCE WARD                                                11 JOE WEST                                                           08 DARREN WOODARD                                             13 ZACH WEST                                                        07                                                                         total 64   Since Price started 04 I tried to limit the list to in the pros starting 05 and until 2014, his grads.  Btw, this is pros as listed by UTEP and not limited to the NFL. Using that logic, Kugler started 2014, so in the pros the 15 will be where I will start for him and Dimel' AARON JONES                                                  17 ALVIN JONES                                                    18 JAMEILL SHOWERS                                           15 DARRIN LAUFASA                                              17 MAURICE CHAVIS                                              16 WILL HERNANDEZ                                             18 WESLEY MILLER                                                15 NIK NEEDHAM                                                   19 KENT TAYLOR                                                    17 ADRIAN JAMES                                                  16 DAMIAN PAYNE                                                  15 ROY ROBERTSON-HARRIS                                   16 ERIC TOMLINSON                                              15 NICK USHER                                                      17                                                             total 14

Talent level drop?  Any questions?  Lots!

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: SisyphusMiner on September 22, 2022, 02:05:32 PM

There is no question that Price was the best coach since Stull, and brought in the best talent by far.
It is my opinion that if we could have held onto Eric instead of turning over the OC reins to Aaron then Price would have been able to turn the corner and build us into a good program.

Unfortunately Aaron turned out to be just like Dimel this year and lived and died by the home run shot -- pass every down, usually 20+ yards.

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: MinerInWisconsin on September 22, 2022, 06:05:33 PM

Quote from: SisyphusMiner on September 22, 2022, 02:05:32 PM

There is no question that Price was the best coach since Stull, and brought in the best talent by far.
It is my opinion that if we could have held onto Eric instead of turning over the OC reins to Aaron then Price would have been able to turn the corner and build us into a good program.

Unfortunately Aaron turned out to be just like Dimel this year and lived and died by the home run shot -- pass every down, usually 20+ yards.

I know Price's teams started losing too much but even his last year was competitive against a brutal schedule. I wish Stull had made a deal to keep Price if he made a change at OC. May not have worked but damn, we have suffered quite a bit. No fanbase should have to go thru all the losing that UTEP fans have.

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: Chanson on September 23, 2022, 09:37:05 AM

Here's an idea. Start talking to John Gruden. He wants to get back into the game.

Title: Re: UTEP Football September 2022
Post by: Minermojo on September 23, 2022, 01:16:31 PM

Quote from: Chanson on September 23, 2022, 09:37:05 AM

Here's an idea. Start talking to John Gruden. He wants to get back into the game.

LOL, John Gruden. Like he would be open to start anew at a lousy college football losing mentality. We couldn't afford him anyway he's used to the Big Benjamins.

Nice dream there Chans. I would kiss your feet if they did hire him but I think I don't have to have fear that prospect.