Author Topic: UTEP v SE OK St  (Read 1646 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Chanson

  • 2017-17 Basketball Official Prediction Thread Champion
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 2282
  • Karma: -59
    • View Profile
UTEP v SE OK St
« on: October 31, 2016, 10:10:00 AM »
Not very many people showed up, but it was great to see the kids work with each other and work on that timing.

The 1st half was not pretty at all. We saw most of the starters play with Thomas, Winn, Flaggert, Omega, & Artis. Winn & Omega are our best players right now. Those two would be welcome on any team in the country. Flaggert & Thomas get my vote for most improved. Flaggert has picked up his defense (thank God) and will be deadly from beyond the arc. Thomas is not afraid to make mistakes and he looks so much more comfortable in the post on both side of the court. Artis had me scratching my head. I know he is an advanced athlete, but I couldn't figure if he was just off or trying to get his team going. He should be fine and will no doubt be the best PG in the conference. While we are still working on our timing, SE OK St was very well coached. The players were not as athletic as ours, but they worked the court well and their timing was better than ours. The last 10 minutes of the game is when I saw the Miners separate themselves from the opponent which is a very good sign.
Then there were the newbies and I have to say I loved what I saw for the most part.

Here is what I saw.

Osborne, Willms, Barrett, & some other kid I didn't recognize sat out and didn't play. I know Osborne is out & they are being careful with Willms, but I don't know the story behind Barrett or the unknown what looked like 6'5" strong looking kid.

Artis- Had some steals, played good D, & hit about a quarter of his shots. Again, he is waiting for timing to come together with other players and he will be great once the rest of the team works well with each other down the road.
Omega- He was a stud. Hit is shots and locked down on D. He could have done more, but I think coaches held him back to get others going. We really could have separated ourselves early from this OK team if he was allowed to light it up. This guy is our best player & made others look like they were playing on skates.
Flaggert- Hit his shots and played good D. If he keeps it up, he will be a silent killer in games. I loved his game (finally). I just wish he would drive more, but then I wished that with JWash and I didn't get my wish.
Thomas- This kid has picked it up. He is looking like a 4* recruit now. He is moving his feet, attacking the rim, & playing good team defense. I really think this kid will come out this year. I still would like him to be more aggressive. Especially with rebounding.
Winn- made some minor mistakes, but he looks good. Yes he lost a pass, missed some buckets at the rim, & looked a little off, but he has a great motor, won loose balls, & had the most rebounds among much taller kids. This guy knows how to use his body & is much quicker than last year.

Now for the non-starters & newbies. We'll start from the 1 to the 5.

Urbanus- Needs work & I hope coach red shirts him. He would get double teamed and he would freak out. He at least didn't throw the ball away and take chances. He needs confidence & that comes with time. CJ Cooper will help him with that.
Touchet- Looks a step better than last year. Very smart player. He still can't hit shots unless his feet are planted. Other than that, he plays hard nose defense plays both PG & SG well. He is not afraid to slash to the rim & even got a few rebounds. I wish Flaggert would drive like he does.
Barnes- Only played a couple of minutes. This kid plays with poise, but seemed he wasn't where he was supposed to be. I think once he understands the play book better, he will play much more. He did have 1 good assist & a 3 pointer.
Cameron- All Miner fans will love this kid. His defense can be compared to JWash. His combo of footwork, strength, height, & motor is awesome. He has super athleticism & has very strong legs. He needs to strengthen his hands & improve his ball skills. This is our lock down defender.
Moore- Needs some work. He can get up and down the court very well, has good defense & understands the play book better than most freshmen. However, he is not a very good shooter & doesn't drive to the rim. He needs more confidence & I hope it comes sooner than later.
Venegas- I like him more and more. He hustles and seems to be the smartest player on the court. He knows where to be and sees the court very well. Luckily he has size, because it makes up for his lack athleticism. Once he knows how to throw his body around he will look a lot more like Ced.
Martinez- At least I think that is his last name. He didn't see much time, but he took advantage of it. He uses his 6'8" heavy body well, but lacks athleticism. He is a fun looking walk on & reminds me of Tafoya in which the team went crazy when he scored. He is one of the trio from Mexico.
Kelvin "THE BEAST" Jones- Yes he fouled out late, but what else do you expect from a freshman big man who likes to bang. This kid is something special. He reminds me of the Plumlee brothers at Duke. This guy fights in the paint and has really good post moves. The kid had an awesome dunk in which his head was above the rim. Who does that unless your name is Anthony Davis? The kid also had a legit block that was called a foul in which he trapped the ball in the middle of board. If this kid stays healthy, the NCAA will know who this kid is towards the end of the season.

I really look forward to seeing these freshmen play. I would have to say this is CTF best recruiting class. Once the timing is put together, the conference will be in for a shock.



« Last Edit: October 31, 2016, 10:34:11 AM by Chanson »

EPTAKE5

  • Iformation Collection/Distribution Editor
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 2326
  • Karma: 55
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2016, 11:01:33 AM »
THANKS  FOR THE EXCELLENT REPORT, PUZZLING WHY NO RADIO COVERAGE.  ATHLETIC DEPT DOES NOT HAVE A CLUE!

Chanson

  • 2017-17 Basketball Official Prediction Thread Champion
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 2282
  • Karma: -59
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2016, 03:17:21 PM »
Teich called the game.

Also, that 6'5" strong kid sitting on the side was Trey Wade. I hope he is as advertised. He is shown as a non-scholarship player. I also forgot to add that Artis had the most points in the contest with 17.

stanman505

  • Mine Foreman
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
  • Karma: 19
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2016, 07:05:23 AM »
I wish I had your high expectations.  We have four guys that can play: Aritis, Omega, Winn and Thomas.  Flaggart and Touchet have zero foot speed and will get exposed in conference play.  Kelvin Jones will be a player once he adjust to the speed of the game.  Until then expect to see him in foul trouble every game.  I saw nothing to change my expectations of a 15-17 win season.

utep2step

  • Mine Foreman
  • ****
  • Posts: 345
  • Karma: -1
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2016, 08:49:46 AM »
I wish I had your high expectations.  We have four guys that can play: Aritis, Omega, Winn and Thomas.  Flaggart and Touchet have zero foot speed and will get exposed in conference play.  Kelvin Jones will be a player once he adjust to the speed of the game.  Until then expect to see him in foul trouble every game.  I saw nothing to change my expectations of a 15-17 win season.

I agree. It's going to tough come CUSA play. If I were an opposing head coach, Winn would be my number one priority with Artis a close second. There is over twenty five percent of UTEP's scoring and play making. Winn is the Cedric Lang, the Dave Feitl of UTEP basketball. He is a beast down low and a headache to match up most times, but he can't do it all. Most opposing coaches will just let the rest have their scraps, they're inconsistent. Omega is a stud player, but is not consistent. He is going to help UTEP win a few games and no doubt he will be at full tilt for Wake. Sadly, he tends to disappear against lesser opponents. Not sure why some fans like Flaggart?. Don't get me wrong, he is athletic and a good kid, but I just don't think he is the type of caliber for this level of basketball. If.....if Floyd had retained all his original recruits for their fourth year (Hamilton, Hunter, etc), Flaggart would be the player at the end of bench subbing for that team mate that needs a quick breather and waving that white towel cheering the team.

ronstr300

  • Mine Worker
  • ***
  • Posts: 204
  • Karma: 18
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2016, 08:55:24 AM »
Geez Stan....

I think a few of the new guys will play a lot. Some do have talent and it will just take some time (this year) for them to pick it up. Trey is quicker than you give him credit. He runs the offense very well and doesn't make bonehead mistakes very often. Dude was state player of the year 2 years in a row in high school. (and NOT in delaware or rhode island) To me, that shows he does have game.
With 4 good players, it doesn't take much to be a very good team.



15-17 wins this year? C'mon man! Easy 20....if the team gels, 25. I'd say probably 2nd in conference.

ronstr300

  • Mine Worker
  • ***
  • Posts: 204
  • Karma: 18
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2016, 09:01:55 AM »
I wish I had your high expectations.  We have four guys that can play: Aritis, Omega, Winn and Thomas.  Flaggart and Touchet have zero foot speed and will get exposed in conference play.  Kelvin Jones will be a player once he adjust to the speed of the game.  Until then expect to see him in foul trouble every game.  I saw nothing to change my expectations of a 15-17 win season.

I agree. It's going to tough come CUSA play. If I were an opposing head coach, Winn would be my number one priority with Artis a close second. There is over twenty five percent of UTEP's scoring and play making. Winn is the Cedric Lang, the Dave Feitl of UTEP basketball. He is a beast down low and a headache to match up most times, but he can't do it all. Most opposing coaches will just let the rest have their scraps, they're inconsistent. Omega is a stud player, but is not consistent. He is going to help UTEP win a few games and no doubt he will be at full tilt for Wake. Sadly, he tends to disappear against lesser opponents. Not sure why some fans like Flaggart?. Don't get me wrong, he is athletic and a good kid, but I just don't think he is the type of caliber for this level of basketball. If.....if Floyd had retained all his original recruits for their fourth year (Hamilton, Hunter, etc), Flaggart would be the player at the end of bench subbing for that team mate that needs a quick breather and waving that white towel cheering the team.

I really don't know why folks on message boards rag on Flaggert so much. How often does he lose his guy? how often does he turn it over? How often does he take a charge? When open and taking a 3, what is percentage? Pretty good no? And if you watch, he is a leader to the others....I didn't hear anyone bitch about kent lockhart and that dude was slow. Jake is a hard nosed player that every team needs. I wish he could get open more often, but hey....cant have everything....

Winn can be a HUGE stud if the guards can get it to him. Artis and touchet can.

Minermojo

  • 2014 AND 2016 Official Prediction Thread Champion-Football
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 1749
  • Karma: -478
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2016, 10:29:58 AM »
You're right about Flaggart but in my opinion the reason people aren't so keen on him is that he doesn't like to mix it up under the basket. It's not because he's short because he's not. I think it's more because he doesn't like to get banged up. With his height he can get rebounds. Heck, even Artis who is shorter gets his share of rebounds.
Revelation 3:20

   

Chanson

  • 2017-17 Basketball Official Prediction Thread Champion
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 2282
  • Karma: -59
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2016, 11:31:22 AM »
I agree Omega, Artis, & Winn are the best on the team and will get us wins, but I am totally with Ronstr & Mojo. Flaggert & Touchet are not flashy & that seems to be what everyone else is looking for. CJ Cooper was not flashy yet he was the glue that all teams need. Those two will hold there own and feed the studs. We still need to see Barnes, Moore, & Cameron a little more. I think one of them will become the freshmen we saw in Omega when he first got here.
Then there is Jones. I like him better than I liked Ced his freshman year. If you remember, Ced was a good defender his 1st & 2nd year and fouled out every game early on. Jones will get in foul trouble, but has better footwork, has offensive post moves, & can actually jump. You saw that dunk & his block on the board. No way could Ced do that even today.

That being said, I understand your reservations. We need to put up those walls so we don't get super disappointed come the end of the year. I have them as well. I'm pretty sure we are not going to NIT or NCAA. I've already excepted that and have decided to focus on the development of the kids.

Go Miners

Minermojo

  • 2014 AND 2016 Official Prediction Thread Champion-Football
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 1749
  • Karma: -478
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2016, 01:40:12 PM »
You're right about Ced not being a jumper. Another that isn't is Wilms. I think he has a 5 inch leap and I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. The only thing that was on their side was /is that Ced was a big body and Wilms is a tall one.
Revelation 3:20

   

ronstr300

  • Mine Worker
  • ***
  • Posts: 204
  • Karma: 18
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2016, 04:55:27 PM »
Jones will be a beast in a couple years. I just hope he develops this year....

I love the attitude and personality of Cameron. He is a kid having fun out there. I really want to see him on the floor a LOT. Naturally, when he starts missing shots left and right, I will change my mind.    :P

liebestraum

  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 504
  • Karma: 53
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2016, 06:12:43 PM »
Jones will be a beast in a couple years. I just hope he develops this year....


Well, given the revolving door we have, I hope he develops sooner rather than later.  He may not even be here next year for who-knows-what reason.

lieb

ronstr300

  • Mine Worker
  • ***
  • Posts: 204
  • Karma: 18
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2016, 06:44:31 PM »
Jones will be a beast in a couple years. I just hope he develops this year....


Well, given the revolving door we have, I hope he develops sooner rather than later.  He may not even be here next year for who-knows-what reason.

lieb

Thanks for being a realist.....

liebestraum

  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 504
  • Karma: 53
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2016, 07:51:00 PM »
Jones will be a beast in a couple years. I just hope he develops this year....


Well, given the revolving door we have, I hope he develops sooner rather than later.  He may not even be here next year for who-knows-what reason.

lieb

Thanks for being a realist.....

Hey,my reality is I've got a senior math major who thinks 2*2*2*2 = 1.89.  Makes me want to roll up into a fetal ball and cry.

lieb

stanman505

  • Mine Foreman
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
  • Karma: 19
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2016, 07:01:34 AM »
Geez Stan....

I think a few of the new guys will play a lot. Some do have talent and it will just take some time (this year) for them to pick it up. Trey is quicker than you give him credit. He runs the offense very well and doesn't make bonehead mistakes very often. Dude was state player of the year 2 years in a row in high school. (and NOT in delaware or rhode island) To me, that shows he does have game.
With 4 good players, it doesn't take much to be a very good team.

Touchet does a good job of taking care of the basketball and runs the offense ok.  The problem is he has very poor foot speed.  He cannot stay in front of his man on defense.  He gets beat off of the dribble, then one of two things happens: 1. One of our bigs comes over and picks up a foul trying to help. 2. Someone else helps and leaves a shooter open.  His lack of foot speed shows up on the offensive end by the fact he cannot create his own shot.  People have wondered why he doesn't hit more three pointers.  The answer is because he doesn't have the foot speed to get open.  Flaggart has the same problems but it isn't as bad for him because of his size and the position he defends.  I like how hard they try but their games have some problems.  I will be happy to eat crow if we win 20 games but I just don't see it.  I think we will have a losing conference record and finish around 9-10.

15-17 wins this year? C'mon man! Easy 20....if the team gels, 25. I'd say probably 2nd in conference.

Minerbball4life

  • Mole
  • **
  • Posts: 85
  • Karma: -32
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2016, 08:58:55 AM »
I with you Stan. Not a bad bunch of kids, but not a team that will make the post season. Touchet is a good player that could have had a nice four years at a DII, but just doesn't have the speed for DI. Same with Flaggart. People always talk about how those two guys don't hurt us, but is that really the point? We need guys that can produce, not just get by.

kyyote

  • Administrator
  • Explosives Supervisor
  • *****
  • Posts: 1334
  • Karma: 92
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2016, 10:27:27 AM »
 lol made my day.                                                        Hey,my reality is I've got a senior math major who thinks 2*2*2*2 = 1.89.  Makes me want to roll up into a fetal ball and cry.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2016, 10:30:55 AM by kyyote »

utep2step

  • Mine Foreman
  • ****
  • Posts: 345
  • Karma: -1
    • View Profile
Re: UTEP v SE OK St
« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2016, 01:42:36 PM »
I with you Stan. Not a bad bunch of kids, but not a team that will make the post season. Touchet is a good player that could have had a nice four years at a DII, but just doesn't have the speed for DI. Same with Flaggart. People always talk about how those two guys don't hurt us, but is that really the point? We need guys that can produce, not just get by.

Well stated. But if Floyd was able to retain all his recruits from three to four years ago, this year was supposed to be a dream.

But it didn't happen and Floyd is flabbergasted and goes off on his diatribes of what could've been and the rules aren't fair in front of the media which goes national. He, fans, staff are frustrated.

So UTEP has to play Touchet and Flaggert; there is no other choice. It's there time to shine. They can embrace this chance to be on the stage and step up or meekly just "do their role". I think Touchet will step up. Flaggart I just don't see him becoming that leader UTEP needs.